Episode 72: Make Room Without Keeping Score

E072 Podcast Transcript
Speakers: Kristy and Tony
Duration: 00:31:40

[00:00:00] Kristy: Welcome to Unshaken, the podcast where unwavering faith meets real life. I’m Kristy, and together with my husband, Tony, we dive into authentic conversations, offering biblical insights and sharing stories that inspire resilience, especially for families navigating the unique challenges of disabilities. Join us each week as we explore faith, family, and the journeys that keep us grounded in Christ. Don’t forget to subscribe so you never miss an episode. Let’s stand firm together.

[00:00:39] Tony: Hey, Unshaken family. Welcome back to another episode of Unshaken. I’m Tony, and I’m here with my beautiful wife, Kristy. Today we want to talk about honestly it’s one of our favorite things to do. Kristy and I, for different reasons, we love to host people. I just like to host because I just like the energy that comes in when you got a house full of people. Kristy likes to host because she likes to feed people and she likes to show people that she loves them by feeding them.

[00:01:09] Kristy: Yeah.

[00:01:09] Tony: We wanted to talk about hospitality. You guys know if you guys have been with us for a while, we do a lot of work with Joni and Friends. A lot of the things that they do are kind of centered around Luke 14 and there’s a pretty cool picture of hospitality inside that chapter of Scripture. When we think about hospitality, you know, one of the first things that you have to answer is who are we inviting? There’s a more interesting question, I think, that I don’t think gets answered as often as it should. That question is, who do we invite when there’s nothing in it for us? Just right off the bat, it doesn’t mean that the people that are on the guest list have nothing to offer. It just means that the invitation is not conditional

[00:02:07] Tony: on what they can give back. And I think that there can be that sort of expectation, right? If I invite you over for a barbecue, there’s this kind of unspoken thing of you’ll invite me over for barbecue next weekend or in a couple of weekends later. Sometimes that’s just not possible. That’s kind of the hidden economy, if you will, behind many of the hospitality games that sometimes get played. When we look at Scripture, Jesus is not just talking about dinner parties or barbecues. What he’s really exposing is the way that we often build our lives around this sort of hidden economy of, I’ll do this and then I expect you to do this rather than the grace that he wants us to extend to others. We have learned to approach every invitation, wondering what we will be expected

[00:03:14] Tony: to give back that hinders connection. I think it hinders relationships. I think it hinders friendships. Jesus wants us to look at hospitality as a way of extending grace to make room without first asking whether or not our presence or someone else’s presence at one of our events is going to be something that’s going to be useful or impressive or easy or profitable in some way. But rather that they’re just there because we want them there and they deserve to be there.

[00:03:55] Kristy: I think with regard to that hidden economy that Tony’s been talking about, I mean, it’s true. We tend to, we invite people over, how many times growing up did I hear? Well, we need to invite so and so. We’ve been to their house twice now or it’s about time they invite us to their house, don’t you think they’ve been here three weekends in a row or that kind of thing. We tend to invite people who invite us. We invest where it feels happy and good, like where there’s friendship, where there’s affection.

[00:04:28] Kristy: We invite people because we like them, you know, and because we’re hoping maybe they’ll be our friends, start a friendship or to grow closer. Like it’s always a big step, right? If you invite somebody like, let’s say out of your Sunday school class, you invite a couple over for dinner, for barbecue, you know, after church or whatever it might be. Like that feels like a big step. It feels like vulnerable kind of and it’s because we’re hoping that, you know, they like us as much as we like them and they, you know, they want to be our friends as much as we want to be their friends, where we feel like we have stuff in common, where it’s going to be easy. Like looking at it from this

[00:05:07] Kristy: perspective, it feels sort of self-centered, right? It feels like it’s, it’s about us, right? We’re inviting who we want, who we wish we could be friends with in exchange for the implication of an invite to their house or because they have invited us to their house. And all of this to say, there’s a lot of people in the world for whom it’s really difficult to invite back. Would we be seeking out, you know, these people to invite if we knew that it was always going to be what we would consider a one-sided thing? We invite them, they come, maybe they, they leave early, it’s difficult for whatever reason. Would we keep making room for them if that’s how it always was?

[00:05:59] Kristy: Sometimes it might be like a situation where maybe people are older, right? And you invite them, and they come, and it’s all good, but they don’t invite you back. And you, you end up wondering, like, did they like us? Like, did we do something, you know? And in reality, it had nothing to do with that. Their house is really small or they’re on, you know, a fixed income and they don’t have extra money to, you know, to throw a barbecue or to invite friends over. But when two, three, five times go by, you know, like we invite you over, and then all of a sudden, it’s every weekend, you come to our house on pizza night on Friday and we watch movies together, is that something that we want to sustain? And I would hope that the answer is yes, because

[00:06:50] Kristy: I think a lot of times that happens in a situation where the invitees are impacted by disability. And maybe it’s hard for them to get a kiddo out of the house. Maybe they’ve got like some specialized equipment that they need or a true food allergy or a significant sensitivity. And, you know, if there’s any number of reasons why people would not invite you back, I think we just have to be really thoughtful about including people that we want in our lives that we want to spend time with, like in a, in a sense of true Christian friendship.

[00:07:31] Tony: One of the things that is very clear in Scripture is to not play favorites. James talks about this in chapter two at the very beginning of the chapter to not play favorites. But also Jesus changes the guest list. If we go specifically to Luke 14, starting in verse 12, when you give a luncheon or dinner, do not invite your friends, your brothers or sisters, your relatives or your rich neighbors. If you do, they may invite you back and so you will be repaid. But when you give a banquet, invite the poor, the crippled, the lame, the blind, and you will be blessed. Although they cannot repay you, you will be repaid at the resurrection of the righteous. In this context, Jesus has been invited to a home and he’s speaking directly to a host, someone who is used to throwing

[00:08:33] Tony: dinner parties, banquets, barbecues in our current context. The room that Jesus is in, it’s already built around status. Jesus doesn’t say, “Hey, be kind or be kinder.” He changes who actually belongs at the table. This is not about the token compassion of, “Invite that one person who never gets invited,” and just check the box. The issue is about changing the entire guest list completely to a guest list that is so painfully obvious that they are not able to pay you back in any way, shape or form. Jesus does more than just notice people from a safe, politically correct distance. He actually makes room for the people that would be considered outcasts or outliers or in the minority on purpose. And he brings attention to that on purpose. And so if you’ve ever been

[00:09:50] Tony: offered a sympathy thing without actual inclusion, Jesus is naming this difference right now. And he’s calling it out right now. This is not about the token invitation or, “Oh, let’s just have this person over to inspire.” And it just makes us feel good. And then we’ve done our good deed for the day. No, invite them because they belong at the table, not in any way to make yourself feel good, because there’s a real difference between being spoken about and being brought near on purpose.

[00:10:39] Kristy: It’s different when the invitee is different, right? In any way, hospitality of any type, having people over, throwing a feast, whatever it is. There’s a cost, right? I mean, certainly there’s a financial cost and the food and you’ve got to shine up your house. And what we were kind of getting at earlier is that it’s easier to invite what I think of as backdoor friends, like the people that you’re just like, “Yeah, come on in.” And if the house is a mess, they’re used to it, because they’re here all the time anyway and whatever. It’s when we actually change the way that we prepare for an event. When we change how we prepare to have people with us, that’s when inclusion is real. It’s when someone else’s attendance really impacts things. It’s not just an easy

[00:11:36] Kristy: no-brainer thing. And I think that’s important. Like Jesus said, it is a responsibility. It is a directive. It’s not a wishlist thing for Jesus. He was very clear. And for us to reach out in that loving way might mean that you got to help somebody get there. Transportation might be an issue. Think about an elder that you might know in your church, just an old couple that maybe they’re not driving anymore. They don’t deserve and they shouldn’t have to stay home all by themselves all the time because they don’t drive. Like go get them. Maybe it’s a sensory situation. Tony and I used to live next door to these horrible people who, I mean, they were just way overboard on the

[00:12:21] Kristy: fireworks. Just every holiday, not just the Fourth of July either. It was like every opportunity. There were fireworks and a member of our family was really, really shaken by that. Like really impacted by that. And we asked, you know, please, can you stop? It’s not even pretty. It’s just loud. And what they told us was, if you guys want to go ahead and leave, that’s fine. We’ll hold off for five minutes until you guys can get out. And I think that is the absolute opposite of the directive of Jesus.

[00:12:56] Kristy: I think it takes some careful communication sometimes. If we do have those food requirements, I guess, an allergy to avoid or maybe it’s a gluten thing or could be anything. It could be like a vegan situation or a vegetarian. Like there’s any number of things that happen food-wise that you really want to have to communicate carefully about. And then maybe that means you have to go and purchase food that you’ve never cooked before. You don’t know how to prepare it. And Jesus would say, oh, well, figure it out. Like that is your responsibility. Maybe it’s an accessibility issue here at our house. Our driveway is short. It’s not like a long drive by any stretch, but it’s very steep.

[00:13:44] Kristy: Even sometimes it’s hard for Tony with his crutch. He’ll have a hard time, especially like if it’s been raining. And again, Jesus would say, figure it out. Help them. Carry them if you need to, and bring them in and not just bring them in, but tell them how excited you are that they’re there and how thrilled you are to have the opportunity to bring them in because they deserve that level of inclusion. It might mean that plans get changed at the last minute because, you know, maybe because there was dysregulation, maybe somebody’s just having a really tough day with whatever the situation that they’re dealing with is. And the thing is, hospitality isn’t measured by whether it’s easy.

[00:14:31] Kristy: It’s measured by whether it was radical and inclusive and loving. And whether you went out of your way to include people knowing that they’re never going to be able to invite you to their house, their party, their anything. Beyond that, we need to realize the privilege of getting to know people who are different from us, but who bring something that no one else can bring to the table. And that’s who they are and how they were made. It’s their perspective on the world. It’s their own expertise, their own love. There’s no way to get that. There’s no way to bring that into a friendship, a Christian friendship other than to be radically inclusive. And that is what we’re called to do.

[00:15:19] Tony: I think you’re absolutely right. And as you were talking, the word that kept coming to mind, it’s in Scripture. And I love the fact that it’s here. It’s towards the end of this parable about this great banquet. And it’s in verse 23. And the word is compel. And I think it’s easy to breeze over that word. I think we need to really understand what is meant by that word because compel is not just ask. Compel is to like literally find them and bring them back, leave no excuse, take away every barrier, every hindrance, every reason for them to stay away, bring them into your home or to the banquet or to the event. It’s going through to say, we want you here and we’re going to do everything in our power

[00:16:28] Tony: to get you here. Jesus specifically names the poor, the crippled, the lame, the blind. When you are compelling people to be a part of your table, now it’s no longer a ministry project. Now it’s moving into a genuine friendship. Now you’re moving into how can you truly be neighbors, even if you don’t, you know, live specifically next to each other. Now you’re moving into, hey, this is a fellow disciple that is chasing after Jesus just as much as I am. Let’s chase together. Let’s become more like Jesus together, learning from each other, leaning on each other, encouraging each other. At the end of the day, it’s also knowing and realizing, feeling the weight of the fact that all of these people that Jesus is specifically calling out to

[00:17:40] Tony: invite, every single one is an image bearer of God. And just on the fact that they are image bearers of God, they have worth, they have value, and they deserve to be at that table. And in none of this is there any talk or any mention of one, them paying you back for anything. And two, whatever it costs you, it’s worth it. Do it anyway. There’s so much value in belonging, helping someone feel like they belong way before there’s even a thought of any contribution.

[00:18:25] Tony: Being able to just see the gift of their presence as a gift. Until we invite them and until they’re there at our table, we don’t know what sort of gifts that they’re going to bring to the table. We don’t know the sort of wisdom that they have until we extend that invitation and they’re actually there at the table. There’s so many opportunities for that mutual relationship, but it doesn’t happen until they’re actually there at the table with you with zero expectation of anything that has to be given back. I’m going to speak from the perspective of someone who is physically disabled. It’s visible. You can’t miss it. If you’re in that bucket, you do not have to inspire the room. You don’t have to earn your place in the room or at the

[00:19:31] Tony: table by being an inspirational story. You don’t have to serve in any way. You don’t have to prove anything or any sort of usefulness before belonging. Your dignity begins with the fact that you are bearing the image of God, not with what other people can actually receive from you.

[00:19:52] Kristy: Something I would add onto that is that when you have a disability, when there’s something about your situation that is different that’s going to require accommodation, you feel some kind of vulnerable when you’re invited. You know it’s a lot. You know it’s a difference. You know that you’re causing somebody to have to go out of their way and you might feel some kind of way about that. And we’re here to tell you you’re human. We get it. But that is not your burden to carry. That burden belongs 100% squarely on the other side of the equation. Part of getting the benefit of getting to know you, of just having you at the table and just truly having the blessing of your company, that is what we as Christians owe. It is what we are asked, called, required to do. You need not

[00:20:52] Kristy: feel any kind of way about that. Your presence is required. Your presence is so important.

[00:21:00] Tony: That is absolutely spot on. It’s a great segue to the actual parable that is in Luke 14 that starts at verse 15. It’s so interesting that the first people that were originally invited to the banquet, they assumed and they took for granted the access that they had to the banquet and they made up these lame excuses about why they could not come to the banquet because they made up the excuses. What does the master do? The master expands the invitation until the house is full. He will not accept a banquet where there’s still room for more people.

[00:21:52] Tony: He keeps telling the servants, “Go out. Go.” And they do this. That’s how God wants his kingdom. God says to all of us, “There is room, not only for you, but there’s room for the people that are on the outskirts that don’t feel like they’re worthy. Go get them and go bring them in. Come tell them to come with you and show up.” But oftentimes instead, we make excuses when we are trying to show a shallow form of hospitality because we say, “Oh, well, it’s a busy schedule.

[00:22:41] Tony: We need to be efficient and we don’t want to make anybody that’s already here or already coming, feel any sort of discomfort or awkwardness. Somebody else that’s closer to them or that has more time, somebody else will do it. We don’t have to. Don’t worry about it. We don’t have to invite them. Somebody else will do it.” And that’s not what Jesus is calling us to. He’s calling us to be the ones to take action. Sometimes exclusions show up and they’re disguised as scheduling or efficiency or uncertainty or doing something slightly less than perfect.

[00:23:31] Tony: But you know that if you’ve been repeatedly left out for these reasons, number one, we’re sorry that that’s happened to you. But please know that Christ does not confuse someone else’s inconvenience with what you’re actually worth because your worth is not defined by somebody else’s inconvenience. Your worth is found in Christ and in the fact that you are an image bearer of God.

[00:24:03] Kristy: Looking at building a guest list, irrespective of who’s on it, whether it’s a new family that doesn’t know anybody, whether it’s somebody with a physical disability or a cognitive disability, or it doesn’t matter who it is. At the end of the day, God brings the reward himself. The people who were invited were invited because we wanted them there. They don’t owe us friendship. They don’t owe reciprocity. They don’t owe gratitude. They don’t owe anything other than to have been included to the best of our ability to have had barriers removed to the best of our ability to have had whatever accommodations or changes that were necessary for their presence, first of all. But beyond that, for their comfort and for their ease, for their feeling of welcome,

[00:25:12] Kristy: kingdom hospitality looks different. It releases the guest from any implication of something owed or a promise of something later. Irrespective of what might come from it, I think most of the time in that situation, we do gain right there on the spot because we did meet somebody who has their own set of experiences and thoughts and values and something to share. But that’s not why we have to ask them. We need to ask them so that they will be included. And it’s not a burden. We need to do it with a glad heart. Yes, we were told to do it. And yes, he means for us to do it even if we don’t want to, but we should want to.

[00:26:03] Tony: If you are invited to someone’s house, to a gathering, to an event, to a banquet, to a dinner, to a lunch, and you are not responsible for being someone else’s success story. Friendship, joy, wisdom, mutual care, those are all gifts that are beautiful, and they may happen. They have to happen freely and organically. Those things can never be demanded as quote unquote payment for having extended an invitation to you to be at said event, whether it’s a barbecue, a dinner, or anything else. You belong there because you already have value not because of what you will do after or even during the event. There are always going to be these tables that we are part of. And I think one of the questions that we need to be asking when we’re around these

[00:27:18] Tony: various tables is who’s missing? Who are we missing from this group or from this table that should be here? The follow-up to that is: What would have to change for that person who’s come to mind to feel like they belong at this table? The question that nobody wants to ask is: Are we only making room for the people who make us feel comfortable? I think it’s important to ask ourselves those questions so that we can start making room for the people that need to be at our various tables, not because of what they can do or because of what they can bring, but because they need to be there because of who they are. At the end of the day, we need to make room and we need to not build the invitation based on what we’ll receive in return for extending

[00:28:22] Tony: the invitation. We have to trust God with the reward that we will receive from Him, not from the people that we’re inviting to the table. For the person who may be in a position of shaping the table, the invitation is to make room without keeping score. For the person who has learned to remain on the outside looking in, receiving genuine hospitality, you don’t owe anything to receive it. Grace allows one person to give and another person to receive without turning either person into simply a transaction.

[00:29:12] Kristy: We’ve talked a lot about inviting people in, inviting people over, but this also means when you go to Wednesday night supper and you see a family sitting by themselves, don’t let them sit by themselves unless that’s what they prefer. Sit with them, go sit by them, be the one who reaches out, be the one at school, teach your kids to sit by the lonely kid. It’s that sort of thing. That’s hospitality too. It’s not just about parties; it’s about everyday life.

[00:29:47] Tony: I absolutely agree. We all can stand to be better at this sort of hospitality. Father, I come before You today, thankful that You, in Your Word, provide us with such a clear example of what hospitality should look like. And so Father, help us to get out of our comfort zones, help us to abandon the hidden economy that can sometimes creep into hospitality and help us to not keep score when it comes to extending grace. Just help us to be gracious folks as we invite those that don’t typically get invited to the tables that we are privileged to sit at. I thank You, Father, for everything that You have done. I thank You for the doors that You’ve opened up for us to sit at new tables and for us to be a part of shaping the tables that we are a part of.

[00:30:53] Tony: Open up our eyes and help us to see the people that we need to invite and we need to compel and help us not to be satisfied until the entire room is filled with the people that should be at the table enjoying the banquet that You have set out before us. It’s in Your Son’s precious name I pray. Amen.

[00:31:18] Kristy: Amen.

[00:31:19] Tony: Thank you guys so much. Hope you guys have a great day and a great rest of your week and we’ll see you next time. Bye friends.